John 17:5
(The false claim of Christ Preexistence)
“And now, Father, give me glory with you; give me the glory I had with you before the world was made.” (John 17:5 NCV, Emphasis mine)
ADVOCATES OF THE Christ-is-God doctrine cite the above passage of John 17:5 to substantiate their claim that Christ preexisted prior to His incarnation as Jesus. They claim He existed from all eternity. Furthermore, they thus criticize the Iglesia Ni Cristo (Church Of Christ) for not agreeing with their belief in Christ’s supposed divinity. Proponents believe that Christ claimed divinity in the verse, some argue that the Church Of Christ, by teaching that Christ is not God, is, in effect, making Jesus either a liar or insane. We must note, that the pre-existence of Christ is a central tenet of mainstream Christianity.
But did Christ really claim to be God in John 17:5?
THE ARGUMENT
Those who believe that Jesus is God claim that in John 17:5, Christ Himself taught that He existed with the Father even before the world was made. They explain that Jesus noticeably used the verb “had,” which is in the past tense, and specified the point in time referred to―“before the world was made.” They thus conclude that Jesus Himself proved that He had pre-existence.
“This whole idea of pre-existence,” they claim, “reveals Christ to have existed before His incarnation” (trinitytruth.org). Incarnation is the doctrine that “God became flesh, that God assumed a human nature and became a man in the form of Jesus Christ” (britannica.com). Some thus believe that “Jesus was a pre-existent divine being who became a human, did the Father’s will on earth, and then was taken back up into heaven” (ehrmanblog.org).
'BEFORE THE WORLD WAS MADE'
The belief that Jesus pre-existed is premised on the use of the verb “had,” which is in the past tense, and the time referred to “before the world was made.” But if we were to agree with such line of reasoning, then we would be compelled to accept, too, that Apostle Paul and the Christians also had pre-existence and must also be gods. In his letter to the Christians in Ephesus, the Apostle Paul wrote thus:
“Thus he chose us in Christ before the world was made to be holy and faultless before him in love.”
(Reference: Eph. 1:4, New Jerusalem Bible, Emphasis Mine)
Take note of the verb “chose” which is also in the past tense form and the very same phrase “before the world was made” as the point of reference. Would we say then that Paul and the Christians had pre-existence and are therefore gods too?
Is it true that Jesus had existed even before the foundation of the world, the way Trinitarians interpret the verse?
Apostle Peter, one of Christ’s apostles, taught the following about our Lord Jesus which would enlighten us in this issue. Let us read:
“Foreknown, indeed, before the foundation of the world, he has been manifested in the last times for your sakes.”
(Reference: I Pet. 1:20, Confraternity Version, Emphasis Mine)
Christ was foreknown by God before the foundation of the world. Now, come to think of this: If Christ had already been existing before the foundation of the world, then, there would not be any need for God to “foreknow” Him. Thus, the fact that He was foreknown by God before the foundation of the world proves that during that time, Christ did not exist yet.
'THE GLORY I HAD WITH YOU'
In what sense then did Christ have the glory from God “before the world was made” (John 17:5) if He was not yet existing then? To answer this, it would be helpful to address also the related question: In what sense did God choose the Christians “before the world was made” (Eph. 1:4) if they were not yet existing then? The answer to this is found just in the succeeding verse:
“God planned long ago that we become His own sons through Jesus Christ. This would please God; it is what He wanted.”
(Reference: Eph. 1:5, Simple English Bible, Emphasis Mine)
“He predestined us to adoption as sons and daughters through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will.”
(Reference: Eph. 1:5, New American Standard Bible, Emphasis Mine)
It is clear, therefore, that “God chose” His people “before the world was made” (Eph. 1:4) in the sense that He “planned long ago” or “predestined” that they become His Children. Take note that this does not in any way mean that those people pre-existed and are gods.
In the same manner, Christ “had” the glory “before the world was made” (John 17:5) not because He was a pre-existent god. Rather, it is because it was in God’s plan or foreknowledge before the foundation of the world (I Pet. 1:20, CV) that “all things … that are in heaven and that are on earth … whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers … [be] created through Him [Christ] and for Him” (Col. 1:16 NKJV).
Clearly, therefore, “Before the world was made, God chose Christ” (I Pet. 1:20 SEB) or “He was destined” (I Pet. 1:20 RSV) to have such glory— although He, like God’s people, was not yet existing during that time.
THE FULFILLMENT OF GOD'S PLAN
The plan of God concerning His sending forth of Jesus Christ—Who was destined even before the world was made to receive glory from God— found fulfillment only when He was born of a woman named Mary:
“But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law.”
(Reference: Gal. 4:4, NKJV)
“This is how Jesus Christ came to be born. His mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph; but before they came to live together she was found to be with child through the Holy Spirit.”
(Reference: Matt. 1:18, NJB)
That was the beginning of Christ’s existence, in the same way that God’s people started to exist only when they were born, though God already had a plan that they would be adopted as His children “even before the world was made.”
ON INCARNATION
Christ’s alleged pre-existence is scripturally unfounded. Even the related doctrine called the “incarnation of Christ” that God (allegedly) became flesh, assumed a human nature, and became a man in the form of Jesus―utterly contradicts the Bible. The Holy Scriptures never call Christ as “God incarnate,” but rather as “the firstborn of all creation” (Col. 1:15 English Standard Version).
Remarkably, the “incarnation of Christ” doctrine sounds so similar to some pagan myths. “The ancient Greek gods normally took on human form” (allabouthistory.org), like Dionysus, the Greek mythological god of wine, who “would often take the form of a human so that he could walk the earth in search of adventure” (greekboston.com).
Knowing that God is categorically opposed to paganism (Jer. 10:2; I Cor. 10:19-22), the apostles called this idea of gods coming down to us in human form as “worthless things” and the apostles thus told people to turn away from them (Acts 14:11, 15 NIRV).
WHOM JESUS TAUGHT AS GOD IN JOHN 17
It is easy to realize that one cannot validly use John 17:5 to prove the assumptions that Christ had pre-existence and that He is God by simply considering the verse’s context, that is, by also reading the preceding verses in the same chapter. John 17:1 and 3 state, thus:
“After Jesus had said this, he looked up to heaven and said, ‘Father…
And this is eternal life: to know you, the ONLY TRUE GOD, and the one whom you sent — Jesus the Messiah.”
(Reference: John 17:1,3 ISV, Emphasis Mine)
To further validate Christ’s words above, for the Lord Jesus, the Lord God is only one God:
“And Jesus answered him: The first commandment of all is, Hear, O Israel: the Lord thy God is one God.”
(Reference: Mark 12:29 Douay-Rheims Bible, Emphasis Mine)
Thus, Christ Himself proved quite clearly that the Father, not He, is the only true God!
IN CONCLUSION
1
Therefore, it is the Trinitarian bias that causes people to read an actual pre-existence into this verse (John 17:5). When Ephesians 1:4 says that God “chose us in Christ before the world was made,” no one tries to prove that we were actually alive with God back then. Everyone acknowledges that we were “in the mind of God,” i.e., in God’s foreknowledge. The same is true of Jesus Christ being foreknown before the foundation of the world, (1 Peter 1:20, CV). Just the simple fact that if Christ had already existed before the foundation of the world, then there would not have been any need to “foreknow” Him.
WE KINDLY EXTEND our visitors an invitation to explore the pristine, unadulterated teachings of Christ and His apostles as they were taught in the first-century Church Of Christ:
The Truth about God and Jesus Christ
SUPPORTERS OF THE BELIEF in the divinity of Christ, also known as the Christ-is-God or the God-man doctrine, assert that God exists as a trinity consisting of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Although they are three in nature and considered distinct beings, proponents maintain that they form a single God. The concept of the Trinity lacks explicit biblical endorsement; thus, proponents often argue that it represents a profound mystery beyond human comprehension and should be accepted by faith alone.
Reach Out
If you wish to acquire a deeper understanding of our Church Doctrines and have any questions, please do not hesitate to reach out to us. We would be delighted to direct you to one of our local resident ministers in your vicinity. Kindly include any queries you may have so that we may forward your inquiry in advance. Thank you.
Please note, we only read and respond to messages that do not contain hate speech or insults...
“Do not let unwholesome [foul, profane, worthless, vulgar] words ever come out of your mouth, but only such speech as is good for building up others, according to the need and the occasion, so that it will be a blessing to those who hear [you speak].”
(Eph. 4:29, Amplified Bible)
“Love endures with patience and serenity, love is kind and thoughtful, and is not jealous or envious; love does not brag and is not proud or arrogant. It is not rude; it is not self-seeking, it is not provoked [nor overly sensitive and easily angered]; it does not take into account a wrong endured.”
(1 Corinthians 13:4-5, Amplified Bible)